Pakistan and India’s animosity – when will it end?

18 07 2009

Pakistanis have a long ‘infatuation’ with India. I would say it an infatuation because Pakistanis want to do everything in accordance with the Indian action. They made a nuclear bomb and Pakistan went on the same track. They tested it and Pakistan wasted no time in detonating its own nuclear devices. The media and entertainment industry of Pakistan is nothing but a cheaper version of the Indian entertainment industry.

Apart from this ‘copying’ game, Pakistan also share a huge animosity towards Indians, which of course it also receives from its eastern borders. Both countries have fought three major and many minor wars. Every five years or so, the world averts a disaster brewing in the South Asian region. The most recent example of this was observed immediately after the Mumbai attacks.

Now Pakistanis are an aggressive nation. They caused all these war and skirmishes by infiltrating into the Indian region and supporting the insurgency movements (there were many apart from Kashmir including Khalistan and Assamese insurgents). Although India can’t be considered a peaceful nation either, they were at least not provocateurs of violence until recently. Now as they are turning the tables on Pakistan by backing the o insurgency and also some groups of Talibans (as per Pakistan’s ISI reports), Pakistanis are feeling betrayed.

Pakistan is also facing serious resentment because of its suppression of minority ethnic groups. The dominant Punjabi establishment will never allow the empowerment of other ethnic groups nor will the feudal system that controls these people like their slaves. India, on the other hand, is free from any feudal society but is facing another crisis: brutal caste system and religious tensions. The long established democratic system has no place for the poverty ridden masses and religious minorities.

The situation is really complex in both countries. While a storm is brewing in Pakistan that can sweep away the very existence of Pakistan, the minimal democracy in India is at least able to act as the lifeguard of the system.

In the next part of this article, I will discuss the complications and contradictions that are destroying the very fabric of South Asia, especially India and Pakistan.

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7 responses

21 07 2009
pakiterroristan

“The long established democratic system has no place for the poverty ridden masses and religious minorities.”

First I thought I will post a polite response asking you not to equate India and Pakistan. When I saw the above statement I concluded you are an arrogant, ignorant asshole.

No place? for povery ridden masses? and religious minorities?
I don’t even think it is worth responding to the statement above to an hypocrite asshole like you.

The conflict between India and Pakistan is an ideological one, not a territorial dispute or a religious dispute. Let me clarify they are out to prove Hindus and Muslims cannot be one country, and they say so openly. Paks think Indian Muslims have to be taken care of by them, an idea increasingly resented by Indian Muslims.

FIRST, Pakistan army has not decided to stop using terrorism as an instrument of state policy.

Some reasons there is some appearance of co-operation from Pakistan are—- (1) single Pakistani was caught alive in Mumbai and spilled beans, (2) dire internal security, economic problems and (3) intense international scrutiny.

SECOND, “ Pakistan ” is an ideological state defined in terms of anti-India, out to prove the idea of India is wrong. We don’t have such issues with them if they live peacefully with the land they got.

Here is an analysis of what is taught in Pakistani schools in Urudu , Pakistan studies classes.

http://www.sdpi.org/whats_new/reporton/State%20of%20Curr&TextBooks.pdf

We don’t have India studies, or Hindusim studies in indian schools and colleges!! I don’t know how many Indians know …students are required to take “ Pakistan studies” at technical and medical colleges!!

Here is a link to the curriculum of Rawalpindi Medical College :

http://www.rmc.edu.pk/pros_collegesession.htm

THIRD,

India left partition behind in 1947, Pakistan hasn’t. They never kept their side of bargain. Thier founder Jinnah claimed (EMPTY WORDS), Pakistan would be a muslim majority tolerant state, we know it is anything but tolerant. Gen Musharaff talked about Gujarat riots at the United Nations in 2002. Where does this fit with the nonsensical claim of Kashmir as the core dispute? And where are the Pakistani Hindus? eXTERMINATED FROM 23% OF POPULATION TO LESS THAN <2% LIVING IN THE FRINGES IN PAKISTAN.

The people who drive Pakistan (Army, ISI, Punjabi elite) view themselves as the inheritor of the Islamic Empire in the sub-continent and India is the Hindu country where muslims are enslaved. Thus nothing will placate their implacable hostility. Each and every single war 1948, 65, 71, 99 and the near wars of 2002, 2008 were all started by Pakistan because the curriculum above produces a militant, warrior society.

It is a serious misreading to claim Pakistan army is the root of the problems. P.A is merely a reflection of its society.

http://pakiterroristan.wordpress.com

21 07 2009
pakiterroristan

You say no place for religious minorities?

Sikhs have their own party. Muslims have their own parties. Christians have their own party in small christian dominated areas.

Muslims get to enjoy democracy for 62 years, got to vote and change governements. Only country in the whole world so many muslims got to vote!!!

Muslims have been Presidents, first citixens of the country. Country has a Sikh prime minister, Christian defense minister, we have had Christian, parsi, jewish generals and war heroes.

Perhaps you read pathetic terrorist lover, India hater Indian leftists like Arundhathi Roy to attain this level of enlightenment.

In the US politicians come in the TV and proclaim America is a christian country and they take oath on the Bible.

In India if a politician comes on the TV and says India is a Hindu country, he will be called an extremist. So much for the psuedo secularism!

I really hope you are not of Indian Muslim origin (I am betting most likely Paki), hopefully an ignoramus from outside the subcontinent.

21 07 2009
proamericanmuslims

Thanks for your ‘kind’ comments. You have raised some good points like the opportunities democracy has provided for the minorities in India. You also mentioned the Evangelical propaganda in the

21 07 2009
proamericanmuslims

Thanks for your ‘kind’ comments. You have raised some good points like the opportunities democracy has provided for the minorities in India. You also mentioned the Evangelical propaganda in the US. Indians do term politicians spewing hatred during elections as extremists in India. They, on the contrary, also support the extremist organizations like RSS. In the US, there are no religious rioting or massacres. There is just plain preaching or propaganda whatever you call it.

Since the creation of India, thousands of Muslims, Sikhs and Christians have been murdered in riots. Isn’t that a fact written on the wall? Pakistan can’t be counted in this as there is hardly any minorities (just ovetr 3%) otherwise they would have also slaughtered the non-Muslims in a big way. Some things still happen like I mentioned in one of my earlier posts.
https://proamericanmuslims.wordpress.com/2009/06/15/forced-conversion-turns-ugly-in-pakistan/

There is huge poverty in India and there is no trickle down effect and same is the case with Pakistan. The military and political establishment of both countries are still in a semi war paranoia, contrary to your claims. They should spend their GDP on their poor people instead.

This is a long debate but I just wanted to mention some facts.

22 07 2009
pakiterroristan

Gotcha. I knew you are a Paki. Gave it away when you mention RSS. I also suspect you are a second generation Paki-American, because you sound less venomous.

Let’s look at you hyperbolic statements. Rioting is third world social behavior, no comparison to US on that. All physical violence on other citizens on based on what ever identity or reasons is despicable.

Lets look at them one by one-
(1) Sikhs- most unfortunate, happend one time in 1984, don’t know what you are talking about. What do you think about one religious group hiding in a “holy” temple, amassing guns and bombs, and kill innocent civilians from the temple for years.

(2) Except for the Gujarat riots in 2002 (mostly muslim deaths), all other riots are Hindus killing Muslims, and Muslims killing Hindus in equal proportions, unless your Paki ancestors educated you otherwise. In India some musloms feel they should come out in procession and kill Hindus if they get agitated over palestinian struggle, or Satanic verses!! I am sure Islamists like you admire and condone such moronic behavior.

Islamists like you who never admit the tolerance and magananimity of the Hindu society is the very reason for the existence of

(3) thousand of Christians have been killed in India. LOL!! You definitely have read anti-India paki hate literature. You gave away on this one. I assume you are referring to the killing of the Christian priest.

Hypothetical scenario-
A small town in Oklahoma, a bunch of Hindu monks in orange robes stand at the local mall and tell all christians are infidels and will go to hell unless they become Hindus. They also pay 2000$ to some poor people and “convert” them to Hindus. You want to see how tolerant that Okalhoma town would be. LOL!!

And finally, about poor people in India. Where do you live? I visit India, very poor people vegetable vendors have cell phones. Your comments are left wing extremist, Islamist hate mongers have such obsession with leftist ideology. One time India was full of beggars, now some have become rich . this is unacceptable. Everybody should stay beggars.

I dont’ expect to chane your closed mind. There is no salvation for you if you think there is “political establishment in India who has war paranoia”

Did you read what I wrote earlier? Each and every single war 48., 65,71, 99 and the near wars of 2002, and 2008 were launched by Pakistan. Or did you read something else in “Pakistan studies”?

What a waste of time.

23 07 2009
proamericanmuslims

I guess it is you with a closed mind and a hate monger. I’ve just stated the facts and didn’t mean to smack any dirt on India, unlike your perceptions. Since when the possession of cell phones has become an indicator of financial strength? That’s really one of the weirdest example of affluence I’ve ever seen. Pakistanis also have cell phones and in fact a better cell phone penetration rate than India but they are still poor, very poor. Aside from the BEMARU states, other parts of India are equally poor. You don’t even have to leave Mumbai to experience the poverty in India.

Oh and what about goons and gang leaders sitting in the national as well as state legislatures? Those who are not also spend millions to ‘earn’ these seats, certainly no poor can get elected in India. Pakistan also has a similar situation along with the intermittent military regimes.

Both countries’ ruling establishment is spending billions and trillions on defense and that’s the sole reason behind the poverty in South Asia.

Now you denied the rioting against minorities in India. I guess you don’t read news or haven’t read about the religious cleansing in Orissa where thousands of Christian families had to flee their homes. Those who resisted were burnt to death.

And there are so many examples of rioting against Muslims including the riots after Babri Mosque demolition, Hashimpura, Delhi riots, Muradabad Massacre and others. Just check from even neutral Hindu sources like Arundhati Roy and they will tell you how many Muslims have been killed and how many Hindus.

You are just a Hindu extremist bigot who does not want to understand the grave realities and try to steer every topic as an attack on India, instead of accepting the harsh realities. There are also many Pakistanis who do the same and every Internet forum is full of that hate mongering. This blog, however, is not aimed at bashing any country and is not even centered at South Asia but the whole Muslim world. Every sane person would known that I didn’t favor Pakistan in that article and presented a real situation prevailing in South Asia. You can reply whatever you want but I’ve already made my point.

Best,

13 06 2010
Sourav Roy

Excellent article! Would like to read more of your posts 🙂
I have recently written a series of articles that might interest you. Read in order-
1. http://souravroy.com/2010/02/02/the-burning-pakistan/
2. http://souravroy.com/2010/05/12/lets-shout-and-not-talk/
3. http://souravroy.com/2010/06/13/the-pakistan-trilogy/

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